Spider

It is a good game but far too difficult. The tasks must be completed in the correct order (and unlike the sequel, there's not really a clue to this as such) The platforms can be a bit iffy sometimes for instance if you jump from the starting position in Factory Gates on the leftmost ledge, its quite easy to just fall off! I'm told that the actual time limit is exceptionally tight, leaving no room for errors. There are a lot of good things about it though! The conveyor animation and the fact Ted walks backwards sometimes on them for instance and the multiple guardian movement paths, not forgetting the "later additions" where certain rooms gain items such as platforms and ladders once certain tasks have been completed, thus allowing further progress. The above gripes (time limit / task order / platforms) can be fixed quite easily. I submitted pokes for the latter two to Tipshop ages ago but they are under someone else's name given they were their work, I merely converted them into pokes. There are some very innovative touches in this that's for sure. There's quite a lot I could write about this if wanted. :)

Most welcome. :) I did plan a selection of differences with various parts of the game (most machines) but its not a quick job unfortunately. For now ( as this took longer than I thought :lol: ) here are the above visual differences, apart from the missing pixel in MAD/Venta Final Barrier. Bug Byte is left screenshot, Software Projects is right screenshot. Title Screen The missing pixel on the car windscreen frame on the BB version: Processing Plant The different item UDG graphic and the different Fire Cell UDG on the conveyor. The latter is sometimes overlooked: The Warehouse The different vertical guardians. The SP ones represent the Software Projects 'impossible triangle' logo: Amoebatrons' Revenge The different vertical guardians: The screenshots were taken up immediate entry into each cavern by inserting a breakpoint to stop code execution immediately upon it being 'ready' as such, this way you get the first real full screen 'frame' of it all. The only 'manual tampering' with the images aside from joining two together with a 4px white border between them was to remove the teleporter boot and set all the air bars to be identical, simply for neatness's sake. :D

One other thing, the MAD (Mastertronic) re-release is missing a pixel on the horizontal guardian on Final Barrier. This is because the byte is missing from the tape file! :D Apart from that and the tiny Basic loader changes (and screen changes) the SP and MAD versions are identical "code" wise. All ZX 'official' re-releases are based on the SP version however.

Thanks. :) That's slightly more elegant than my method of changing it to calling twice for a 'beginners/easy mode' game, and leaving it at four calls for normal/difficult. I did consider calling it five times on a hard game setting but given its not that easy anyway it would be near impossible to complete the cavern if I did that.

The code changed a bit (as well as teleport code) to allow the IF2 joystick to work properly, really this means changing it from the 'Cursor' joystick to the Interface2 standard. Talking of code the source remnants in the BB version are replaced in the SP version with a repeating pattern of 00/FF (000,255) , bear in mind most of the code is not in quite the same place in the SP version! Teleport code changed. Active key moved from 6 to 9 because 6 is used by the IF2 (its in theory used by cursor too but it signals "down" so its not used in MM as such) Scrolling message changed as well as loader with attribution details. The sprite differences are not huge the main game sprite changes are: A missing pixel in the title screen / Final Barrier in M.W's car windscreen frame is filled in. This is not a common thing to be noted! The fire and item cells in Processing Plant are different , this is also not always noted! The vertical guardians in Amoebatron's Revenge are different The vertical guardians in The Warehouse are different Code below 33902 is identical between versions (aside from char changes) Code above 33718 is identical between versions (aside from sprite changes etc) Code between these is either 6 , 11 or 13 (accurately it should say 6 then 13 then 11) bytes higher up See this topic for a bit more info on the loaders if curious. External links with more details can be found here and here if required. :thumbsup: As an aside in other platforms, there are some screen changes too. In particular the BBC Micro version has a completely different full screen Final Barrier and no Solar Power, replaced with 'Meteor Storm' iirc. There are screenshots of all this (for most platforms) in various topics in the JSW section if curious.

The "Beaker Store" ? :D :) That was a good idea. This got me thinking but I suspect it may be completely impractical, the length of the beam should be reduced by a block or two per item collected. I do realise its length varies depending on where its pointing to, but what I sort of mean by this is: No items collected = beam travels all the way to the wall/floor One item collected = beam stops one or two blocks before the wall / floor Two items collected = beam stops two or three blocks before the wall / floor etc Upon reflection (no pun intended) I think one block per item is enough as once you've got two or more there's essentially a small gap if you're near the edge of the cavern...

Me too in regard to your last sentence, but mine was the BB version. :) It was actually a month or three after buying JSW that I purchased MM...

Thought about one 'each side of the wall maybe but I'd not looked into it yet. :) The switch idea does sound a bit more sane really now you mention it! :thumbsup:

https://worldofspectrum.net/ Overview here Topic on Spectrum Computing about this > https://spectrumcomputing.co.uk/forums/viewtopic.php?f=24&t=2947

Could be done I think without a huge amount of trouble by at a guess just removing a couple of earth cells to allow M.W to jump over it :unsure:

I think this may be something I'd like to implement in one future game project perhaps. Ideally with a warning and maybe some careful cavern design so that the Portal is 'in the way' a bit too, as in not buried in a corner harmlessly ;)

I wonder why most (if not nearly all) third party modifications to Manic Miner use the Bug-Byte variant instead of the Software Projects one. I realise the BB release came before the SP one, but the latter does fix up a couple of small issues main one being the joystick control for an Interface2 I consider the disassembly however some early mods may of appeared before this was out and about, I've not checked dates on that though. I do plan a difference file with skoolkit to create an SP version of it at some future point too, it is on my radar so to speak. Unless it was down to sheer numbers of tape sales, as there are/were more BB MM tapes about, I can recall this from B.I.T.D too, I never saw a SP version for the Spectrum in the shops, whereas nearly all the other versions were (the reason for that is they were only released by SP) , also if you take a look at a non-ZX site for -ahem- "game downloads" and grab a Spectrum version or two of MM, chances are they will be the BB version. :unsure: This is partly why the last few MM variants out the door here have been SP based as it really needs a bit more airing I think. I'm not saying its superior in any way as the changes are relatively small all-in-all but they are appreciated ones.

Noted two YouTube video's of this... Manic Miner with Light Modification (2020) Walkthrough, ZX Spectrum https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W3GVWY1Iq0Q Let's Play Manic Miner Dark Light Modification & First Impressions - 2020 ZX Spectrum Game https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xHXfni4ZVJU

That's quite excellent. :) It does work quite well and add atmosphere to the game. Some credit must go to Pgyuri for the idea initially but I can perhaps foresee this general principle being good for various third party games. Regarding JSW, I do agree its not terribly ideal however certain screens could possibly use it, perhaps something like WineCellar or other potentially 'dimly lit' areas. Does pose a slight quandary there with if he should have a miner's lamp/helmet or be carrying a torch of somekind but I guess that is something for a different topic. My other feedback I'd posted previously (not as a hint in any way merely a thought regarding blue/black background area) was if M.W has 'seen' an area it should then remain in blue afterwards, by this I mean the cavern starts as black aside from the area lit by his lamp, but once he's 'seen' an area but left it, it goes to blue.

I did note the proportionally spaced text for the alpha characters :) Its a nice touch to do that.

Thanks for the update Norman :) The change does look good and its useful to see that information. If it is any help the link for the post in question can be easily obtained by clicking the http://jswmm.co.uk/public/style_images/master/icon_share.png share icon on the top right of the post to bring up a small modal-popup window or simply saving the link from the post #ID number. The former provides a slightly better link though. Popup 'share' link > http://jswmm.co.uk/topic/548-playing-around/?p=12123 Post link > http://jswmm.co.uk/topic/548-playing-around/page-12?do=findComment&comment=12123 Quick embedding... [url=http://jswmm.co.uk/topic/548-playing-around/?p=12123]This Link[/url] Produces... This Link I know you're probably well aware of that but felt it prudent to mention it for others perhaps.

:) I did wonder about that too, perhaps extending the "visible area" by say 2 blocks which would in theory give M.W just enough time in hopefully most cases to avoid too much trouble! One twist on that perhaps would be to set the 'previously seen' areas in blue. By this I mean when a cavern starts, its dark however once M.W has moved over an area that turns blue rather than black, but his 'immediate area' remains lit as per now. I'm not sure how well that would work out. I'll point the mod author towards this topic (they are aware of it anyway) to read the latest feedback and thoughts.

Congrats! :1st:

Will check that out, have heard of it but that's as far as I know. I do appear to already have it, AMS version, does not appear to be a ZX version, not to immediate hand anyway. Not 100% sure why as in theory its not a complete rewrite to move software between the CPC and the ZX So similar in one way to our games here, "collect the bits and move on!" :D I have a CPC464 , wish I'd got the 128 at the time, this was a few years ago when they were at their lowest prices "retro sales" wise I mean before the resurge in interest. To be honest I may sell it anyway as its hardly used. One thing is its length, at least if you place it next to a +2 its huge! :lol:

Thanks Norman. I did strongly suspect the Amstrad version of JSW1 was 'based' on the JSW2 version, the other clue to this is the "fall off the platform" thing too. Also explains why I had so much trouble trying to find a stand-alone release on tape of JSW1 for the Amstrad, ended up using the TSAM compilation release. Thankfully it was only protected with an early (Spectrum) Speedlock so taking it apart was not too difficult. This resulted in me being able to present a tape based infinite lives variant of JSW1 Amstrad while still retaining its original loader, reasoning was most "trained" (I hate that word somehow) versions were nearly always disk based. Was well received by the AMS site too. Although there's an entry here for those, the actual 'modified' AMS tape file I built is attached merely for reference. Note this is an Amstrad CPC tape :D despite it being a .tzx instead of a .cdt, mind you there's not much in that other than extension naming I suppose. Works properly on the CPC6128 too: JSW1_Infinite_Lives.tzx Screenshot combi, Loading Screen/Initial HighScore Table/Title+Splash Screen/Starting Room:

A cursory quick play (until this evening when I have free time) shows excellence so far! :)

I was thinking a while back about this... Has anyone given any thought to editing other machines versions of JSW and/or MM ? In particular perhaps the BBC Micro and Amstrad versions. I am aware of one slightly modified MM Amstrad game but from memory only the first couple of caverns were edited and nothing else. In theory at least MM and perhaps JSW1 on the Amstrad (but I've not looked if they use the compression stuff they do with JSW2 in JSW1 on here) ought not to be that difficult to do. The BBC version (not Electron version!) despite being 6502 based may not be that bad either, although I'm not sure how the room data is stored in that, I am well aware that it would be sensible to avoid JSW2 on this platform given there's two versions of it but that's something detailed in another topic. Suffice to say the tape/disc versions of JSW1 and MM are single loaded and work 'as is' without further input data requests. This JSW version -does- play really well I think, MM would be OK had the sprite flicker been fixed, I understand there's actually a theoretical fix for that. Plenty of screenshots of this and other versions in their appropriate topic(s) So the question remains, are there any thoughts to editors on these platforms perhaps ? I've purposely excluded some other variants for being too poor and/or too similar. C64 (square stairs -sigh- and bugs galore) and MSX (near ZX identical) etc. The Oric Atmos version of MM is not bad though p[rovided you use the third party fixed release not the original release, but no-one ported JSW to it yet.

Slightly confused. :) Is the above snapshot meant to stay 'light' in area's he's visited ? :unsure:

Well it will be here for as/when you wish to :) I've informed the 'modification author' of this topic via email so he may have some comments I can post perhaps at a future date.

Meant to say the only immediate change I'd probably think about (myself anyway) is to expand -slightly- the visible area, perhaps by just one or two blocks both horizontally and vertically. All credit where it is rightly due though as Pgyuri has applied this effect so that you have a blue 'shadow/darkness' on the edge which shows care/thought in its inception imo. :)