MtM

Ho! Excellent news! Like an early Christmas present! Very happy _the_ MM/JSW resource is back online. How about a Christmas MM version to celebrate?

Apologies if this has been seen already ... https://spectrumcomputing.co.uk/forums/viewtopic.php?f=21&t=2985 It's quite good fun. I would expect 100% from the people on here...

Is Manic Panic finished then Norman, or anything else in store with it?

Yes, Kokotoni Wilf was another great game from the same era, but as has been said, not quite the magic of MM & JSW - they just have ingredient X, a certain magic about both games, even now. Some of it is clearly psychological nostalgia, remembering our hopefully happy childhoods, but I don't still play MM & JSW for purely sentimental reasons, I enjoy the gameplay and find it rewarding, and for what my opinion is worth, there are virtually no new decent PC games worth playing anymore for me, I have almost given up with them. I enjoyed RTX Quake II, not much since. I agree entirely with what you say about TT The Megamix, and this is the version I currently have in progress, slightly easier and bigger and better generally, and in truth I have poked it for infinite time too as it detailed above. I have Costa Capers on the go occasionally too, but as you say, innovative - yes. Good gameplay? Hmm. Sometimes. I think it might be slightly easier than TT though. But a bit of a hybrid. Still, the Marsden and Cooke team I think it was they did provide some very high quality software, technically very good, mega loaders (TT The Mega Mix is just stellar and the first time you ever saw TT was a thing of amazement as I remember.) I think Costa Capers was their last game sadly.

Diplomatic, that ;-) I hope it doesn't upset anyone but I find it virtually unplayable. A mod too far. Sorry. I commend all your efforts Norman, and without trying things you do not know what can be done.

I am all ears and will gladly read what you can tell us all about the game. It is way too difficult for even a very good gamer as you say. I suppose one thing that is easy for us all to compare who has played MM/JSW & TT are the game mechanics. I like and prefer the more organic/looser style of jumping in MM etc to the sharper jumping feeling in TT, there is more chance for 'personal style' I think in playing MM, whereby TT seems to demand accuracy. My own style, dictated by certain screen design, was found wanting only yesterday playing Pac-Manic-Miner-Man on the Next, a port of MM to the Next using the Pac Man hardware running through RAMS. When on The Cold Store a move I usually make would not work anymore because the timing is slightly different, so it affected my style of play etc. You are right, everyone who has an informed opinion of TT states the time limit is absolutely nails, and combined with the very high degree of difficulty of the screens esp. in the first release of TT where as you say there is no guide even only a few lines in the notes on the cassette inlay to get you started with which tasks first etc. it is approaching impossible for most gamers. Real pity because it has a wonderful feel to it, and looks stellar in places with the sheer smoothness of movement. I suppose this argument is similar to what I have said about some MM & JSW mods, they are just way too hard straight out of the box for me, and remain that way. The degree of difficulty in both the original MM & JSW I think is near perfect, as each screen you tackle the skills are built up as you play over a reasonable period of time, they allow you into the game. Even JSWII falls foul of being too difficult in places, as much as I like it.

Yes, I am sorry, I have seen the references and the music I think in one version too, I should of mentioned that. I do have JSM too.

Yes, I did get the reference thanks, apologies should of made it clearer. It was a nice touch all around. Even in what, 1983, people were making pop references in computing and gaming to things from only a few years ago, circa 1980 Pac Man I think. Perhaps at that time programming itself was a cultural phenomenon, and absorbed and reflected the popular culture of its day.

Just wondered what opinion people have of T Ted around here? It seems superior technically to JSW, but inferior in terms of playability. Any thoughts from the real programming gurus on here? I have never looked, but I guess that T Ted doesn't have the kind of following the JSW / MM has. I personally really like T Ted, but it's simply too difficult to get anywhere with it. I will make a concerted effort one day to complete it, but it will need infinite time at the least I think. I also wonder if there have been mods of T Ted, never heard of any, but I have a feeling that the programmers of it encrypted the room data so it wasn't possible to edit, but I could be wrong.

Is it possible Norman to have an option on the title screen to turn the effect on or off, and maybe the difference it could make in scoring, or playing. Maybe if you got to the end with the dark light effect on you get to play a bonus screen that is unavailable otherwise for example? I noticed too for instance on screen three that the effect causes considerable mess with the graphics when squeezing in between platforms where the height difference is only enough for Willy to walk through if that makes sense. No bugs it's just the effect kind of corrupts the surrounding graphics temporarily.

Definitive that! I wonder if M. Smith ever said anything about this, that he had gone back and tweaked the code, or someone else maybe who did it? Presumably he did it himself, I wonder why really? At this point JSW must have been in the preparation stage at least. I do like the ghost on the conveyor belt, that is a nice touch and doesn't seem familiar to me I will check next time I play the original.

Apologies Dr B just in case I wasn't clear - I mean actual match programmes, glossy physical programmes from actual tennis played at the Championships, I do not mean recorded tv tennis :-)

Borg vs McEnroe from 1980 on BBC 2 today, the final to end them all! I have a few old programmes from Wimbledon I am going to recycle if you want them for free of course?

My goodness, that is very thorough, thank you for the information. I knew something changed with the Amoebatrons. I had it in my mind the telephones changed too, or The Bank or something, but no matter. That is top work!

I have the SP original version of MM on my shelves here. I prefer the SP version of it just down to the JSW continuity I guess, and as stated, there were a few changes / improvements, didn't a few sprites change? I know it will all be listed somewhere.

I do not follow these things closely, I remember the chap who used to run WoS leaving as he had met someone, then it seems to have slowly declined since then, and is now changing format over a period of time. I have no idea if true, but I feel that something has gone on that I know nothing about.

If only someone would use this in an modded version of Technician Ted, that would make it much easier ;-) I think that there would be some scope for its use in JSW, or a new modded version of JSW anyway. I like the idea that the room stays lit once travelled through, or the parts that were travelled through do at least, albeit it doesn't seem very logical. I like the idea too of having to collect a special item that then enables the lamp in JSW, say a lamp shaped collectable item, and then the room can be lit with it. But then I wonder how that impacts new level design for a screen that will be played partially in the 'dark' so to speak? Maybe it doesn't.

That is an amazing level of skill/knowledge/memory. I would need a normal version running side by side to refer to. Very impressive.

Likewise will get on it tonight, thanks Norman :-)

I thank you for this version, but far too hard for me, couldn't even complete The Central Cavern. I like the effect, and it is a good idea in theory, but in practice it ruins playability for me. How about once you have been to an area it remains lit? That would help playability a bit. Sorry, I hope you aren't upset with this.

That is wonderful that you are working so hard, Norman, on Manic Panic. The programming insight is very interesting too, even for non-programmers it is good I think to read about the technical aspect of writing games, here at the lowest level of programming often. I also like the story you have come up with for Manic Panic, the whole revisiting the original excavations, I think that is a good addition in terms of being authentic - what is that slightly preposterous phrase they use for Star Wars, something like 'staying within the canon' or 'it is considered lore'. There are some silly stories out there in the MM / JSW world, excellent mods but daft stories to justify them. I think M. Smith would approve of this particular story. For me, the paragraph or two explaining the story you got on the original tape inlay card when you bought the game was vital for the initial spark of the imagination, which is where the game itself would then hopefully take over. Manic Panic's story has that I feel.

Any new version approaching release yet Norman, over 0.4 beta?

This may be true Norman but I think it has helped enormously this game, and I really salute it. I hope it becomes a mainstay of all future mods etc. Yes I have Manic Mixup, not played it for a bit, as I recollect it is in that psychological gaming cabinet of being 'a bit too difficult' ;-) I will return to it. It is almost like playing a bandit the big bonus - can you gamble to stay on screen long enough to collect the points? I really appreciated this insight into coding Norman, more than seeing z80 code listed on here it is the abstract of the code, the symbolic, that I think is really interesting. This kind of reinforces what you said previously Norman about change. I think it is really good, to play a MM or JSW game without being killed instantly by a sprite or fire cell is counter-intuitive at first, and can sometimes be, admittedly, confusing on some levels due to their design and look, but it does also increase the game's playability, and of course with the skill level you can play it old style too where everything that you expect to kill will kill you. I hope that once this is finished, a big push is made on all the forums like WoS and Spectrum Computing etc. to get the word out and a lot of downloads and people playing it, it is a great game!

Maybe you should!

Sorry, I guess the way I explained it was a bit confusing. The issue comes from the display of the crumbly brick, if it had been overtly crumbly floor I would of understood the level straight away. Probably a thesis there on semiotics in games. Thinking about it, yes, I remember the tennis rackets of course in The Cold Room, but I had never thought of them as snow shoes either. There is _definitely_ a thesis about semiotics in games here!